Super 4 2010 frame dull dull dull

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February 08, 2012, 12:28:40 PM

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Total Voters: 252

[stubs69]

After months of swapping cracked 2009 Super 4 frames and 2010 Super 4 frames with seized swinging arms I finally got a bike that worked.  However after about 3 months of thrashing the bike and doing my usual clumsy riding I have come to the conclusion its a tough frame but its dull as ditchwater. 

When I got my 2009 Super 4 I absolutely loved it, it handled brilliantly had snappy turning but could get me out of trouble when I rode past my skill.  I knew it wasn't the lightest bike around but the weight just seemed to disappear when I started stomping the pedals.

However the 2010 frame which weighs about a pound more seems to be carrying even more weight than it actually weighs on the scales, the handling just doesn't feel snappy and I always feel like the back end is going to wash out on fast flat turns.  As for berms it feels like I am top heavy and I just cant hold the line I want to and keep exiting all wrong and having to jump on the brakes rather than jumping on the pedals like I should.  Also there is a lot more pedal bob on this frame I have started using the lockout on the RP2 shock quite a lot when I am in the 36T ring.  I dont recall using the lock much unless I was honking it up a steep tarmac road in the granny on the 2009 frame.

It was only the frame that was changed so the components are exactly the same so any one got any ideas how to turn this bloody anchor into a singletrack missile before it goes on ebay

[Steve P]

I'm very suprised that the frame weighs a pound more.  Same tyres?
You haven't got a seat tube full of water have you 

I have an '09 55. I've ridden Damo's '10 55 and it doesn't feel the same.
Not saying it isn't as good, just 'feels' different.  Not heavier though.

[stubs69]

I'm very surprised that the frame weighs a pound more. 

Yes so was I when I got the new frame out of the box.  I weighed the 2 fames together I cant remember the exact figures but the 2010 frame weighed 15 and a half ounces more than the 2009 on my fishing scales.  The 2010 frame is a completely new design it is different than the 2009 in virtually every tube.  It has a different swinging arm similar to an old Meta 5, the seatpost tube is a lot thicker in the wall in fact it has to be tapered at the top so a 34.9mm clamp can fit, the down tube is a box rather than round section.  There is a lot more metal and it looks better welded but somewhere the designer has changed the bike completely and lost the zip that the 2009 frame had.

All components apart from the tyres and the grips are the same or the same model.  I have tried 4 different tyres on the back to try and alter things.  I have tried the tyre that came with the bike originally a Maxxis Larsen (piece of shit) , a Maxxis Ignitor (the same tyre that was on the 2009 when it bust) a Specialized fast trak and a borrowed Schwalbe Rocket Ron all tyres in the 2.0 to 2.1 size range.  I have tried 2 different tyres on the front a Maxxis Ardent 2.25 and a Kenda Nevegal 2.35.  Played with the suspension settings moved my saddle forward then back, tried a shorter then longer stem, rotated the bars forward then back lowered the bars tried some borrowed wider bars.

Whatever I try the bike just handles like a lump of metal.  Please someone wave a magic wand before I go and do something stupid like buy a Specialized.

[Steve P]

Anthem's get good reviews 

[stubs69]

Anthem's get good reviews 

My mate has an Anthem X4 and its a lovely bike just not quite what I am after a bit too racy.  Cannondale RZ 120 looks good I will have to try one out just not sure if there is a Cannondale shop in my area.  Also like the look of the Ghost range of bikes only seen them in magazines so far but they look tasty.

[iain1775]

Your right that was dull dull dull, i lost interest half way though first post

[bong69uk]

Your right that was dull dull dull, i lost interest half way though first post

    me too 

[Steve P]

   Ignore them ^^^

Dare I say it ...
Orange ST4 

[stubs69]

Dare I say it ...
Orange ST4  

I like the look of the ST4 it seems to be what the Super4 was last year.  A quick singletrack machine which is what I like, I am too old to start throwing myself down mountains pretending I am a freeride/DH god.

A mate has suggested getting the shock serviced before I do anything drastic like buying a new frame.  Also I might try and shift some weight off the wheels.  I like the look of the Superstar wheelsets you can spec your own build quite fancy some red super hubs, black spokes and Stans Crest rims.  That would dump about a pound off the current lardy set, might make a difference and wouldnt break the bank.

[stubs69]

I think this might be the answer to my problems if only I could find the pennies

[iain1775]

well after settling down with a large coffee and ploughing through the dullness

yep completely agree
throwing money at exactly the same frame but in carbon will address all your issues with said frame

oh no wait, it may loose some weight but what about -
dull handling
rear end washing out on turns
not turning in sharply enough
feeling too top heavy
pedal bob
not holding the line

I suspect you would spend a bunch of money on that and not like it, finding it handles like a 'lump of tupperware' rather than a lump of metal
It would be lighter, which may address some of your issues, but it is still essentially the same bike and I don't think you would be happy

What you need fella is not a new bike but to improve your 'usual clumsy riding' (your words not mine)so you can get the most out of the bike you have got.
Spend your money on skills courses first not a new bike

Sorry if that sounds harsh but it is the same conclusion I have come to about myself having recently fallen out of love with my 3 year old Meta5 after having spent a bucket full of cash improving wheels and brakes etc

[stubs69]

Yep that could be it as soon as my 2009 frame went back to Madison and I started riding the 2010 frame I instantly forgot how to ride a bike. 

Yes that sounds sensible got to go and book myself on a course straight away.  Which do you reccomend or would my 15 years of riding club Cyclo Cross in the 70s and 80s, 10 years of XC racing in the 90s and the last 20 years of riding classic twin shock MotoXross get me on a good one.

Do tell you are a wise man and a riding god and I really want to ride a bike as well as you. 

[chrissturch]

Yep that could be it as soon as my 2009 frame went back to Madison and I started riding the 2010 frame I instantly forgot how to ride a bike. 

Yes that sounds sensible got to go and book myself on a course straight away.  Which do you reccomend or would my 15 years of riding club Cyclo Cross in the 70s and 80s, 10 years of XC racing in the 90s and the last 20 years of riding classic twin shock MotoXross get me on a good one.

Do tell you are a wise man and a riding god and I really want to ride a bike as well as you. 

Wow, pissy.  If you read his post he actually says that he feels it would benefit him as well, so he clearly doesn't think he is a "riding god". That is the first time you've mentioned how much riding you've done, so without that info its a reasonable suggestion that skills training might help and you also clearly put, "my usual clumsy riding" in your first post. I would have thought someone with your riding experience would be past the clumsy stage by now... 

[iain1775]

well the 'usual clumsy riding' quote was yours not mine so you obviously didnt learn much from all those years 'experience'

im not claiming to be a riding god, far, far from it, as at least 20 people on here that have been riding with me (and prob Bong too for good measure even though we have never met ) will only to quickly testify  (and hence me also looking at skills courses so I can improve and get more out of my meta)

but I dont see how a carbon version of the same frame you so obviously dont rate at all (with exactly the same geometry and bottom bracket height, but just a slight difference in weight) will help you either?

again something I would have expected someone with 30 years of riding experience to know

strikes me you just wanted to rant, without really knowing what you are ranting for 

[bong69uk]

(and prob Bong too for good measure even though we have never met ) will only to quickly testify  

Dude you have got me all wrong, im all about spreading the love man, i was about to big you up and say you were a decent rider with good experience to back it up    .

Yep that could be it as soon as my 2009 frame went back to Madison and I started riding the 2010 frame I instantly forgot how to ride a bike. 

Yes that sounds sensible got to go and book myself on a course straight away.  Which do you reccomend or would my 15 years of riding club Cyclo Cross in the 70s and 80s, 10 years of XC racing in the 90s and the last 20 years of riding classic twin shock MotoXross get me on a good one.

Do tell you are a wise man and a riding god and I really want to ride a bike as well as you. 

And Stubs it doesnt mater how much riding you have done you can always benefit from riding with ither people and going on courses (why do you think the teams at races all train and practise together,they all try to gain from riding with anohter person to pick up tips etc ), maybe all those years of riding have let you create some pretty bad habbits etc??
I have been rding for most of my life, since i was 11 , so thats a good 12 years on the bike (i took around 4or5years off when i hit 19 and found the joys of beer and loose women    )  and during that time i spent a fair few years racing DH and racked up a good few results , being on the podium a few times and never ending up lower than 10th spot, even with mechanical probs and crashes, but i am the first person to admit that i would benefit from riding with different people to pick up some new skills and tips etc and i reckon a dh course or the likes would benefit me massively ( i just need to swallow that slice of humble pie i have been harbouring about chris ball of dirt school, as i am gutted to pay for advice from a guy i used to race against and quite regularly beat     )but i reckon with his experience and skills that he will have picked up from riding the world cup circuit a class with him will do me the world of good.

So in short dont go beating up my boy Iain , get your ass on a course